TALK - Rozmowy [H]

[blackgoku]

❀Aksamitka błyszcząca (Tagetes lucida)❀
potocznie Sweetscented marigold' [ang. nagietek ze słodyczami xD]
Opis
Kwiaty żółte.
Surowiec
Ziele (w trakcie kwitnienia) zbierane podczas nowiu Księżyca, ścinane obsydianowym nożem. Zbierane w innym czasie nie ma żadnych szczególnych właściwości. Składniki czynne: nieznane. Czynniki znane nie uzasadniają działania (być może nie zbierano rośliny we właściwym czasie). Stosowane w postaci naparów, wywarów lub w postaci pasty z roztartej rośliny. Czasem palono z dodatkiem innych roślin. Być może tajemnicą działania rośliny jest interakcja składników tej rośliny z alkoholem.
Działanie
Oficjalnie: żadnych szczególnych właściwości.
Naprawdę: silnie odurzające, halucynogenne i przeciwbólowe.
Zastosowanie
Leczenie bólów przewodu pokarmowego i reumatyzmu (kąpiel z dodatkiem wywaru).
Zastosowanie u Majów
Podawane z napojem alkoholowym (ze sfermentowanej kukurydzy) używano do wywoływania wizji.
Zagrożenie
Psychozy parafreniczne (paranoja, halucynozy).



Jakie są substancje psychoaktywne odpowiadające za halucynacje?

[mistrzudron]

z tego co wiem to DMT powoduje w chwastach halusy ale koneserem nie jestem więc Ci dokładnie nie pomogę. poszperaj na HR na bank był już podobny, wytłumaczony temat ;)

[blackgoku]

Jak był, to zapodaj linka, bo Twój post nic nie wnosi :-)

[mistrzudron]

viewtopic.php?t=29248 nic prostszego

[AnnaS]

http://entheology.com/plants/tagetes-lucida-marigolds/
Opis dzialanie podobne do szalwi w mixie z tytoniem lub duzych dawkach.
Dwie substancje ,pochadza z dwoch rodzin odpowiadaja za ten efekt jeden zwiazek z tiofenow drugi beznofuranow.
Ciekawostka we wszystkich aksamitkach te dwa zwiazki sa trwaja intesywne prace by ustalic ich wzory chemiczne.

[blackgoku]

Do salvia divinorum? W jak dużych dawkach? Jest szansa osiągnięcia 4 stopnia psychodelicznego?

[AnnaS]

prawdopodbnie jest tylko ile trzeba nie wiem.

[blackgoku]

Mexican Marigold (Tagetes lucida)
Common Names: Anise Marigold, Chili Marigold, Mexican
Mint Marigold, Mexican Tarragon, Pericon, Spanish Tarragon,
Sweet Mace, Sweet-Scent Marigold, Sweet-Scented Tagetes,
Texas Tarragon, Winter Tarragon.
Drug Eff ects: A narcotic or mild psychedelic that is said to
induce feelings of tranquility when smoked.
Classifi cation: Relaxant, Sedative
Short Term Eff ects: Relaxes nervous system, mild
euphoria, relieves anxiety & tension, closed-eye visions.
Classifi cation: Very Mild Hallucinogen
Classifi cation: Narcotic, Pain Reliever
Classifi cation: Stimulant
Long term eff ects: anaesthetic, antidepressant, anti-
infl ammatory, antipyretic, antispasmodic, antibacterial,
antidote, candidicide, digestive, diuretic, febrifuge,
fungicide, hypotensive, myorelaxant, nematicide, pediculicide.
Negative/Overdose Risk: Lower blood pressure, dermatitis, photosensitivity.
Active Constituents: 1,8-Cineol, Allylanisol, Alpha-Cadinene, Alpha-Cadinol, Alpha-Calacorene,
Alpha-Copaene, Alpha-Cubebene, Alpha-Muurolene, Alpha-Selinene, Alpha-Terpinyl-Acetate,
Anethole, Anisaldehyde, Anise-Ketone, Beta-Bisabolene, Beta-Caryophyllene, Beta-Caryophyllene,
Beta-Ocimene, Beta-Selinene, Bicyclogermacrene, Caryophyllene-Oxide, Chavicol, Coumarin,
Cubenene, Dihydro-Tagetone, Eugenol-Methyl-Ether, Gallic-Acid, Gamma-Elemene, Globulol,
Herniarin, Huichol, Ketones, Leucoanthocyanins, Limonene, Linalool, Methyl-Eugenol, Myrcene,
Neophytadiene, Patuletin, Polyacetylenes, Quercetagetin, Quercetagritin, Saponin, Sapthulenol,
T-Cadinol, Tagetone, Tannins, Terthienyl-Aa, Tetrahydrotagetone, Thiophene, Torreyol.
Contraindications / Interactions: Currently, there are no known warnings or contraindications.
Psychoactive Ingredient In: Smoking Blends, Balche (Drink) Incense, Sence.
Legality: Contains no controlled substances.

AFOAF has tried tagetes in the past but didn't get much out of it. With German chamomile he might get decent effects though. Tagetes taken with 5 grams of German chamomile brewed into tea, or 3 drops of German chamomile oil will probably be more interesting than taking it alone because most of the oils present might work better with a CYP1A2 inhibitor.

Methyl chavicol (AKA estragole) can produce a very decent euphoric psychedelic trip at 200-500 mg as long as CYP1A2 is inhibited (this works for AFOAF and a few others but might not work for everyone). If CYP1A2 is not inhibited, it does almost nothing at all. AFOAF and a few others have been playing around with this psychedelic in combination with German chamomile for quite a while. This is a pretty nice psychedelic. It seems to affect more people than nutmeg does, and in a good way (as long as CYP1A2 is inhibited). It also potentiates the effects of other psychedelics (this is probably why tagetes is used with peyote).

Anethole is an isomer of methyl chavicol and is rumored to also be psychedelic. I'll bet in combination with German chamomile its psychedelic. AFOAF has not tried pure anethole yet, but probably will sometime in the near future.

AFOAF is planning to revisit tagetes lucida in the near future. In the past when he used it, he was totally unaware of the existence of psychedelic oils like myristicin, elemicn and methyl chavicol. He tried this herb many times, and did eventually get a tiny bit of an effect from it, but nothing psychedelic, and then he ran out of the herb.

In all the history I've read, this herb is supposedly taken to potentiate the visions of peyote. It's not used to induce visions on its own. But I don't think the natives knew about German chamomile or other herbs that inhibit CYP1A2, which seem to help activate a lot of these psychedelic oils, at least in some people. The natives did however know about Banisteriopsis activating things like DMT orally, which is a very similar phenomenon.

One batch of Tagetes lucida essential oil analyzed professionally was found to contain 95-97% methyl chavicol. That's very high. That's more than sweet basil usually has. This must be the main active in this herb. AFOAF has both pure methyl chavical, and also sweet basil oil high in methyl chavicol.

If AFOAF takes 250 mg of pure methyl chavicol by itself, it produces a mild sedative effect and very slight visual effects. It's so light you could easily not notice it. But when he takes 250 mg with 5 grams of German chamomile, he gets a full array of psychedelic effects comparable to LSD in a lot of ways. He gets lots of euphoria, mild stimulation, visual effects, etc. Without the CYP1A2 inhibitor German chamomile, methyl chavicol is uninteresting. It's similar to how harmala alkaloids activate DMT orally in AFOAF.

I bet peyote has effects on CYP1A2 and other enzymes, and peyote is actually activating the tagetes, rather than the tagetes potentiating the peyote. For AFOAF, elemicin is greatly potentiated by cacti, and not the other way around. LSA is also greatly potentiated by cacti. When AFOAF takes elemicin with cacti, the whole experience becomes a very strong elemicin experience instead of a mescaline one.

I am going to have to get a new batch of this herb to play around with. With his recently acquired knowledge of things like CYP1A2 inhibitors and how they work with methyl chavicol, I'm sure he'll be able to get better effects from this herb. He's excited to revisit this herb.

Besides CYP1A2, methyl chavicol should also be inactivated by CYP2A6. Both of these enzymes apparently cause 1-hydroxylation of methyl chavicol which presumably produces an inactive sedative. So for some people CYP2A6 may need to also be inhibited!

What inhibits CYP2A6? Well cannabidiol found in cannabis inhibits this enzyme and should therefore make tagetes more psychedelic. A mix of cannabis and German chamomile taken orally (not smoked) should be very good at helping activate tagetes. The German chamomile will inhibit CYP1A2, and the cannabis will inhibit CYP2A6 (to some degree at least).

What is a strong CYP2A6 inhibitor that is easily available?

Apparently nicotine inhibits CYP2A6. No wonder natives mixed tagetes with tobacco! I'll bet peyote contains a strong CYP1A2 inhibitor. If it does, peyote and nicotine should activate methyl chavicol very nicely. If my theory is correct.

Another CYP2A6 inhibitor is supposed to be coumarin, found in Chinese cinnamon (cassia). Cassia oil contains up to 11% coumarin.

I found a study showing that star fruit juice inhibits CYP2A6.

Curcumin inhibits CYP1A2 but enhances CYP2A6 activity. So turmeric should probably be avoided.

https://drugs-forum.com/threads/tagetes ... gon.23400/

[blackgoku]

Właśnie spożyłem 1,2g suszu Tagetes lucida. Susz był zaparzany w garnku od mleka. Gotowany około 30min. Na sam koniec (niestety) dorzuciłem do wywaru miętę pieprzową, która jest inhibitorem CYP1A2. Wymagana jest do działania psychodelicznego. Jeszcze nie wiem, jaka jest biochemia tego procesu, ale na pewno się dowiem i Wam opiszę.

Nie jestem pewien, czy susz ma właściwości halucynogenne (czyli nie tylko psychodeliczne), ale na pewno psychoaktywne. Silnie działa na GABA. Niezwykle relaksuje, ale też powoduje takie odczucia hipnotyczne, jakbyście wieczorem, jadąc samochodem jako pasażer , patrzyli się w okno i obserwowali zmieniający się krajobraz.

Według mnie doskonała substancja nasenna, jednakże nic nie wiem jeszcze o długotrwałym stosowaniu. Jestem w trakcie badania. Zrobiłem znowu wywar z 1g suszu. Zaraz go wypiję. Na bieżąco będę wrzucał tutaj co odczuwam.

[Triptamine77]

Czemu "niestety" dorzuciłeś miętę pieprzową?